Nina Mason, Pro Landscaper: Why Recognition Fixes Your Labor Shortage

Rob Murray (00:31) Alright everybody, welcome back to another episode of the Landscape Growth Podcast. I can say with a hundred percent certainty that we have a unique guest on in the true definition of it, Nina Mason. Thank you so much for doing this.

Nina Mason (00:43) Thanks so much for asking me to come on.

Rob Murray (00:45) we had a chance to meet as you were putting Futurescapes up together in LA in 2025 for the first time hitting the shores of North America. And it seemed like it went pretty well and you guys have been doing this for a long time on the other side of the pond. So maybe give this audience a little bit of a snapshot of this 44 group and and what you’ve all been up to for the last many many years.

Nina Mason (01:06) Yeah, absolutely. So we launched 15 years ago with what we say is our flagship publication, it’s Pro Landscaper. So our founders thought there was a gap in the market for a B2B magazine that solved, sorry served the landscaping industry. So you know landscape designers, contractors, and probably an opportunity to kind of bring them all together under one. roof essentially. So we launched that magazine, we’re celebrating our 15th anniversary this year. The following year, we then thought we’d kind of bring that magazine to life. So we launched our trade show, which is Futurescape. We started off, it was just a one day trade show of kind of bringing this audience together. It’s now grown into a two day trade show. And we’ve actually now launched that, as you just mentioned, we’ve launched that in the US. We’ve also just held a version of the show in Saudi Arabia, kind of bringing together those who are working on these big giga projects in Saudi Arabia and perhaps international consultants want to work on them as well. Yeah, there’s a lot of opportunities in the Middle East. So that particular show is showcasing what’s available and what they’re looking to do with their vision 2030. So yeah, it’s really, really grown. And we also launched Pro Landscape USA magazine at the start of last year as well.

Rob Murray (02:02) Crazy.

Nina Mason (02:21) And on top of that, we’ve launched something called Pro Landscaper International, which is a publication that showcases the projects that are shortlisted and the winners of the Pro Landscape International Awards as well. So they’re really new to the company, but we’ve been holding regional heats for those. And then the final takes place at FutureScape Global in Saudi Arabia. So it’s been really exciting.

Rob Murray (02:43) Amazing. Yeah, well and I think this is a very great example of the uniqueness of your perspective, right? Having this international exposure from you know UK to Saudi Arabia to the US. there aren’t many folks in the landscape industry that can confidently share that. So thank you for doing this. The meat and potatoes of the show, what’s the primary growth constraint holding entrepreneurs back in the green industry? Now I’m just like super curious, is it the same everywhere? Like are they are they always like what what do you see as the common thread holding these folks back?

Nina Mason (03:14) Yeah, well, I I interviewed somebody who is an African landscape architect last week, and she said exactly the same thing as a constraint. We’re seeing the same across the US. Saudi Arabia is the same and in the UK. It’s very much to do with recognition and perception. We spoke just before we came on about the fact that the UK has seen this. massive push to become recognized as a profession. It’s becoming more professionalized over the last 10 years. And businesses are really starting to see themselves as businesses rather than one man bands and wanting to improve their systems, their approach, their training and their educational aspects as well. So that’s something that perhaps has been holding industry back. before, but I think there’s been a massive push that not being such a constraint anymore. And what that would hopefully address, I suppose, is the labor shortage that I think most landscape industries are seeing. We’re seeing it in the UK and we’re also seeing it in the US. It’s one of the biggest challenges of the industry. I think promoting what we do in landscaping, how incredible the profession is and the fact that it’s a career rather than a job. certainly would be a great way of attracting new talent, but maybe more importantly, retaining that talent.

Rob Murray (04:30) Yeah, that’s cool. It’s it’s really interesting you say that too, ’cause ten years ago I did my first talk for the landscape industry and I asked everybody like who hears like we reference all these, you know, authors and speakers like Simon Sinek and Jim Collins or John C. Maxwell, and it was like two out of three or four hundred people at the time and then asking similar questions like two years ago, and it’s like eighty percent of the room are reading these things. And what I found really cool and similar in what you’ve just addressed is this trend towards this professionalism. Everybody kind of raising, you know, it’s like the rising tide raises all ships, and so like the industry itself is getting smarter, better, more professionalized. and so I’m just curious with this idea because it sounds like it’s almost like the leaders of these companies are really starting to take leadership seriously. And we always talk about this idea that the only way you’re gonna be able to attract people is to be a leader worth following. Even if your industry is amazing, if someone comes into your company and you’re not a leader worth following, they’re gonna leave and find someone else that’s gonna bring value to their lives. Do you see any common threads in the companies that are having an easier time attracting talent versus the ones that aren’t in the leadership style of the entrepreneurs that run them?

Nina Mason (05:34) Yeah, I it probably won’t come as much surprise, but the word culture is on everyone’s mind at the moment. You know, how can you create a culture that people want to be part of? And that can mean many different things. You know, sometimes that means spending a lot of money on, you know, wellness programs, gym memberships, free tea and coffee, whatever it is. But I think at the heart of it, what we feel is at the heart of it a lot of the time is allowing people to have… progression pathways. It’s allowing them to know that they can actually develop in the company. Because a lot of people leave and set up their own companies or will leave to join another company because they feel that they haven’t got an opportunity to move forward in their career and develop and step up the ladder. So I think that’s one of the biggest things that companies are trying to introduce. Certainly we as a company are trying to do exactly the same thing, is make sure that people feel that there’s a next step for them that they’re working towards and that they’re being celebrated along the way as well.

Rob Murray (06:22) Yeah, that’s cool. I mean and and it and when you say it it sounds so, you know, simple and intuitive. But but the amount of people that take the time to build that out, you know, to slow down essentially to then speed up, you know, all these cliches that we hear in business, it seems like they’re few and far between. And what’s really interesting In the way you framed it is that I’d say the most successful entrepreneurs that we’ve interviewed on this show, and by success I mean building companies that don’t depend on them, all kind of view their business as a training and development company that happens to do landscaping.

Nina Mason (06:49) Yeah, I think that’s really interesting and like you say, this stuff takes time. It’s not something that you can just say that you do and kind of get away with it to a certain degree. You actually have to sit down and take the time to think about what they want. There’s an individual aspect to it as well. And I think some people feel worried that if they do that and they train their members of staff and they give them all these opportunities, that they’re just going to take everything that they’ve learned and go somewhere else or take it and set up their own company. But I think you’re taking exactly the same risk if you don’t put just as much effort into keeping them. So, you know, it’s balancing those two things.

Rob Murray (07:21) Well, I think it’s even more risky to not Pour into those folks because if they if you do and you add value, the odds of them wanting to stay is probably higher. And they’re gonna be better team members, they’re gonna contribute and bring more value. and but it is definitely a catch-22 and when you hear talking to people about like the idea of people leaving after they’ve been trained up. So going back to this idea of recognition, you know, you talked about the idea of the industry and the professionalism and being recognized as a career pathway and as a professional industry. What what else is there when it comes to this recognition component? And and to bring it from you know Africa, Middle East, UK, US, like what what do you see as the thing that people might be able to tease out of our conversation that they can maybe apply their own?

Nina Mason (07:59) Well, I mean, this might sound a bit maybe self-promotional, but obviously we have initiatives as well as a magazine and an event where we can help recognize people within the landscaping industry. And there are a number of ways that you can do that. We have been running since 2015 in the UK something called our 30 under 30 initiatives. people under the age of 30 within the industry can apply to be one of our 30 on the 30 winners each year. And that’s a real chance to kind of catch people at the start of their career who are really, really ambitious, achieving great things and probably have really, really great things ahead of them. as well. So that’s something that we’re launching in the US in a particularly different way maybe it’s called our Rising Stars Initiative. We had it at Futurescape USA last year and we’ve opened entries for again this year. And I think that’s an opportunity for leaders to take the spotlight off themselves. briefly and put it onto some of their members of staff that they think are really starting to make waves and show how wonderful they are and how integral they are to the businesses too. Because it’s not just down to the leader, it’s down to the staff too.

Rob Murray (09:01) Love that. Yeah, so rising stars. Okay, so quick one, and it’s okay to be a little self promotional here. I mean it’s kinda we want to highlight what it is you’re doing to help the industry. What what does someone do? Well, first of all, what is Futurescapes USA? The you know the the pr the primary audience listening to this is gonna be American and Canadian. but if they wanted to go to Futurescapes USA last year was in LA in December, this year what’s the time? Wha how do people go check it out and maybe sign up?

Nina Mason (09:25) Yeah, so this year it’s in September in LA. We’re actually holding two Futurescape USAs this year, one on the West Coast and we’re launching one on the East Coast as well. Both of them are looking to bring together people under one roof. I think one of the things that we felt was the case in the UK was that people tended to operate in silos. You’d have your landscape designers, you’d have your landscapers and then you’d have your maintenance professionals. But in terms of…

Rob Murray (09:35) Sweet.

Nina Mason (09:51) conversations happening between those sectors, that there wasn’t really the opportunity to do that as much. So with ProLandscaper and Futurescape USA, what we really want to do is… bring those together to have conversations and hopefully people can take away learnings and understandings from those that help them all to operate better together. So breaking down silos in a way. And Futurescape USA, its main purpose is to bring those people under one roof. We’ll obviously have some great exhibitors there as well. So you can see some of the latest innovations on the market, explore some of the latest technology. I think in some ways the US landscaping industry is maybe a little bit more ahead than the UK industry in adopting certain technologies.

Rob Murray (10:28) Yeah yeah.

Nina Mason (10:28) So this is an opportunity to discover more of those and figure out also how other businesses are addressing some of key concerns. So take inspiration from them, listen to the talks, see the innovations and see the product demos as well.

Rob Murray (10:43) So how do I sign up for that?

Nina Mason (10:45) You can register to attend for a free ticket. It’s on our website. That’s on the first and second of September. And our Florida show will be taking place in December.

Rob Murray (10:54) And what’s the website?

Nina Mason (10:55) FUTURESCAPEUSA.COM

Rob Murray (10:56) Beautiful, nice and simple. That’s exciting that you’re doing one in Florida in December.

Nina Mason (10:59) Yeah, I mean it’s great. We launched on the West Coast and we wanted to kind of stay focused maybe on that area for a little while just to build up a bit of a following. I’m sure as you already know every state is very different. There’s new legislation, every practice is maybe slightly different. They’ve got different issues.

Rob Murray (11:14) Well in Cal California specifically is probably an outlier in terms of regulation, yeah.

Nina Mason (11:18) Yes, yeah, that’s certainly been something that we’ve learned and has been fun to get on top of. And also because of, we’ve had to tackle things like the wildfires and landscaping issues kind of related around that as well. And then you step over to the East Coast where they’re perhaps tackling different issues like, you know, how can you create a landscape that is as resistant as possible to hurricanes and those types of conditions? So.

Rob Murray (11:23) Ha ha.

Nina Mason (11:43) That’s why we’re realizing that maybe one show that is for everyone isn’t maybe going to be the best approach in the long term. We want to set up shows that we can tackle kind of different audiences.

Rob Murray (11:51) Yeah. In different regions. That’s super cool. So then this Rising Stars initiative, if I’m listening to this and thought I have one that I want to recognize, how do I do that?

Nina Mason (12:02) We’ve got a form if you go onto our socials or go onto our website, there’s a Rising Star page on both Futurescape USA and Pro Landscaper USA website as well where you can register your Rising Stars.

Rob Murray (12:13) Love that. And super simple. Beautiful. All right, so you’ve got recognition for rising stars, you got recognition for the industry. This is one of the things been holding people back. you know, when you look across this kind of vast perspective of like all these different entrepreneurs you guys have been supporting, what what’s something that you see as like a common symptom of like an issue? that can be addressed with something. Like you’re like, you know, we run into these we see these problems happening all the time. and then we see these people that address them properly. Like what’s the most common issue you see when it’s like comes to holding people back from growth inside their business?

Nina Mason (12:43) Inside their business, I mean, it’s inside the business and outside their business. think communication is always going to be one of the biggest things that we think that companies struggle with. But again, that’s not just internally. I think that’s externally too. We often talk about projects being so much better when companies collaborate early on or you bring the landscapers early on, of course. So I think communication is always going to be one of the the biggest constraints and arguably one of the easiest things to resolve.

Rob Murray (13:07) Interesting. Well it’s c it’s it’s cool ’cause for I don’t know, maybe three years here at Intrigue, we kept hearing things like communications difficult, communications you know, there’s a lot of friction. and I I wasn’t really in the weeds enough to understand the impact of it, but then we put a bunch of resources and focus on it and it changed the customer experience like drastically by overcommunicating versus like not and then there was this idea that if a customer ever says what’s the status on this thing, you’re like already way behind the eight ball. So if customers are saying that and the team doesn’t know what’s going on, or like when someone calls in, someone’s like, Well I’ll get someone to call you back about that ’cause I don’t have the answer in front of me. Can you tell us some of the tips or tricks that you’ve seen people implement when it comes to strengthening communication inside an organization? Or out?

Nina Mason (13:45) I mean, there’s, I guess there can be such thing as too much, but I think, like you say, people are going to definitely complain about too little rather than too much. I mean, there’s really, really simple things. It’s making sure that you’ve got, you know, weekly or monthly, whatever works best for you catch ups. We make sure as a company, for instance, we’ve got a lot of brands. We don’t just work in the landscaping sector. We also have a recycling part of the business too. And some people are working across multiple products. So we’re just making sure as teams that we’re bringing each other together as often as possible to be able to catch up about those aspects. There’s internal newsletters that you can do. Sometimes it’s as simple as making sure that you’ve got WhatsApp groups on the go. You have to be really careful with those. are pros and cons to that because that can very, very easily stretch to out of hours communications. But I think it’s a really great way of like casual communication, but keeping people in the loop.

Rob Murray (14:30) interesting. Well and I think it’s cool too ’cause it’s super accessible. WhatsApp is a really neat idea too, ’cause like a lot of people, at least us, like Slack, Slack, Slack. Everybody uses Slack. But then like introducing a new tech stack or a new technology into an organization, it’s like, okay, there’s just another thing I gotta go check. It’s just another thing I gotta go do. But WhatsApp is super simple, everybody’s using it all the time anyway. And it was interesting, we had a a guy on the his name’s Shai Egosi and he was on a couple weeks ago. And he bought a pool company in Florida and he said the communication was horrible and that’s what they did. They started team WhatsApp chats and then project WhatsApp chats. and it said it improved like the whole project implementation like crazy. So like you’re it’s like two people in like four weeks have said WhatsApp is an easy way to start making communication better. So if you’re listening, maybe think about it.

Nina Mason (15:13) Definitely. Yeah, and like I said, there is such thing as maybe too many WhatsApps and you do have to be really, really careful because that’s what people are using to chat to their friends as well. They don’t really want to receive a message probably outside of hours from their workplace, but it does make it really simple and it’s all in one place. So it’s definitely really helped us as a business.

Rob Murray (15:31) Yeah. That’s super cool. So then what was something that shocked you about the industry when you brought it across the pond? You know, last year you guys ran FutureScape in LA. What was something that you didn’t expect?

Nina Mason (15:42) I don’t know about didn’t expect, but one of the biggest differences certainly is the way that the US landscaping industry perhaps fills its labor gaps. So in the UK, it’s predominantly British labor, really. And when we’re looking to pull more people in and attract people to the industry, it’s very, very much, I guess, British citizens that we’re looking to do that with. Whereas in the US, especially for the bigger companies, I suppose, what you’re looking to do is is use HTV visas, for instance, to fill those labour shortages. So it’s a very, very different way of of operating. I think that’s one of the biggest things that we kind of had to get our heads around.

Rob Murray (16:12) Mm-hmm. Cool. And then what was something that was like different in terms of the way they operate outside of I mean that’s a big one. But did you see any nuances that maybe folks in the US can draw from like you do in the UK, like in terms of what the landscapers are doing over there that maybe are best practices that maybe we don’t quite understand yet?

Nina Mason (16:32) It’s interesting when you depending on who you speak to will say whether the UK is ahead or the US is ahead in certain practices. I think California is is ahead in some ways in this regard in terms of like climate change or climate resilient landscapes. But I think most people would feel that the UK is leading the way in that regard. That’s one of the things that we’re we’re really, pushing in our industry is sustainability, eco conscious gardens. less paving, hardscaping is, it’s not really vilified, but it’s certainly starting to be kind of almost on its way out in some ways, unless it’s permeable. And I’m not saying the US doesn’t do that, but I think it’s probably ahead and especially in our business practices, that’s what’s really being pushed to staff too.

Rob Murray (17:07) Right. No no of course No, that’s cool. I can so we s what, maybe three years ago, so we we we monitor, you know, Google search for whatever, almost two hundred companies. And and then we do it across the entire, you know, the continent, North America. And we’ve seen Xeroscape, sustainable landscaping, drought resistant landscaping, all the search terms just like and it’s across the board. It’s not just in one given state, it’s across everywhere. and so when we’re talking to clients, we find that there’s kind of two buckets. There’s one that people are they have these practices in place but they’re not putting it up front, so they’re missing out on the opportunity. But there’s still a huge bucket of people that aren’t even working that way yet.

Nina Mason (17:48) Yeah, and I think the biggest buzzword maybe for lot of companies now, I don’t know how much the US knows about legislation in the UK, but we introduced biodiversity net gain like two or three years ago now, which means that developments have to achieve a minimum of 10 % gain of biodiversity on sites post development. And that means that the word biodiversity is starting to be recognized by the public as well as in the industry. So when companies are updating their websites or looking to update their services, they’re including biodiversity specialisms within that as well. Yeah, we’ve seen a massive drive in that. And I think that will probably start to come over the pond to a certain degree.

Rob Murray (18:20) Super cool. Yeah, well and if anything it’s gonna be driven by the consumer. Like people are looking for it. And so if people don’t start helping, you know, fill the need, someone’s going to at some level. Like it just the consumers drive the market, right? That’s kinda where it starts. So you’ve been doing this you’ve been with them what, ten, twelve years, something like that?

Nina Mason (18:42) Yeah, I’ve been with the company maybe on and off, suppose, for 10 years now. Started out as an editorial assistant. Now I’m the content director, so heading up. The magazines that we produce as well as the seminar programs for our shows as well.

Rob Murray (18:56) Right, and so being able to understand what a market well there’s two things. One is what do they want and then what do they need. But having like a decade of experience trying to build content and programming around serving the landscape industry, what what do you see as like common themes or maybe even something that’s completely shifted over those ten years in terms of like what these folks are looking for or need to hear but don’t necessarily know it.

Nina Mason (19:19) well, I, I guess the, the biggest thing is going to be around technology. You know, 10 years ago, we didn’t really talk about that. Now it’s probably one of our biggest topics. I was just putting together the seminar program for our UK show and so many of the talks are kind of tying in this topic of AI. And, it’s, some people are really, willing to adopt it. Others are really, really against it. I think when it comes to improving business practices. there’s a lot more willingness to take on some AI tools. But I think when it comes to utilizing it in your actual practices, so using it for design, for instance, there’s maybe more of a reluctance. And I’m not sure how much that differs in the US, but in the UK, there’s one of our key associations is very much against this idea of using AI to design.

Rob Murray (20:04) That’s like schools not being okay with Google, but it’s r it’s really interesting. I think it’s a really cool topic too. And I think a lot of people also don’t understand like some of the use cases and like core functions of AI. and so we’re doing the tech and lawn landscape or the yeah, lawn and tech expo in Arizona this year in July, which is

Nina Mason (20:07) Hahaha

Rob Murray (20:22) a crazy place to do a conference i in july like i know if you’ve ever been to arizona in july but it’s like an oven anyway. and one of the things we’re gonna try to help shed some light on is like your data structure is actually the core focus inside a company to leverage AI. It doesn’t have to be building emails or copy and newsletters or even design. Now that being said, it’s getting better and better and better. And this isn’t going away. So if you’re listening to this and you’re like, F AI the landscaper next to you that it’s embracing it’s gonna kick your butt in a couple of years. So, go ahead, you have a thought there, I wanna finish it mine in a second.

Nina Mason (20:52) No, that’s fine. I was just thinking of this idea of it being a tool rather than a replacement because I think that’s usually the argument, isn’t it? It’s just going to replace people. We hear that all the time and I’m sure you do as well. But I think it’s knowing how to use it wisely. I mean, we have designers who do our magazines. They’re not garden designers, but they’re producing our magazines. They’re producing the assets for our shows. And we’re not looking to replace them with an AI tool. But there are certainly AI tools that they can use within their existing software that can speed up some of their processes. But on the flip side of that, we’ve noticed that when AI is being used to create certain assets, it does distort certain things. It can distort your branding. It can get a lot wrong. And it can, in some ways, weaken what you’re trying to put across. So I think it’s just learning to use it really, really wisely and making sure that anything you’re putting out to the public, you are checking first.

Rob Murray (21:38) yeah, for sure, right? Every everything that gets published needs to have human eyes on it first. And for the record, like a landscape designer will be able to use AI to design better than I can. In like in in like but that but I mean like there’s just such an a huge opportunity. But one one of the things I’m not sure if you’ve heard anybody talk about this at all, but one of the biggest like initiatives we’ve been on is collecting all the information that we require from a prospect or a client in order to be successful implementing whatever it is that we promised.

Nina Mason (21:47) Follow me too.

Rob Murray (22:03) To implement. And so essentially there’s this giant spreadsheet of information that we have to get from somebody. And it’s like, you know, different stages of the client journey. We require different information to be successful for the next phase of the journey. But that exercise has shed so much light on the friction inside the company. And we’re doing it all so that we can like automate and compile and pass information from one person to the next. It’s got nothing to do with like replacing somebody’s role. We’re just trying to get rid of friction within the organization for the passing of information from one place to another. I think that’s probably at its core one of like the best use cases for AI and it I think it’s it’s industry agnostic. Have you heard anybody talking about like core organizational information structure as a focus in AI at all?

Nina Mason (22:46) I think one of them, I don’t know if that’s necessarily what people are using it for at the moment. Like I said, I think in some ways the UK businesses are maybe a little bit behind in that regard. But I think one of the key things that maybe landscaping companies are using it for is getting back to the things they actually enjoy doing. And again, it sounds really, simple, but a lot of landscapers I speak to don’t want to be sitting on their emails. They don’t want to be doing the admin side of things and they don’t want to be putting quotes together a lot of the time. and they want to be outside building gardens, so how can they use these tools to help do the things that they just really, really don’t enjoy doing? And I think that’s how we can use that technology in the future.

Rob Murray (23:21) yeah, today for sure. Like a hundred percent. Is there is there any like platforms that you see people use commonly right now that people should check out?

Nina Mason (23:28) I mean, it’s one of really simple ones is just things like Claude, isn’t it? And I’m trying to think of what the AI note taker is called as well. But these are fantastic tools that you can take along to your client meetings and they can summarize it for you so that you’re not having to do that when you get home or do it in the evenings.

Rob Murray (23:43) Yeah, there’s one called Fieldly here, another one called Plod with the P. Yeah, yeah, yeah. And it could just sit in your pocket on the back of your phone and completely transcribe the whole thing. Also can become a sales coach, so you don’t have to go in field sales visits and coach somebody and watch somebody just mangle a sales process. You could just debrief them afterwards. I think there’s a bunch of use cases there.

Nina Mason (23:47) that’s the one I was thinking of, yeah.

Rob Murray (24:03) So if there was something that you wanted to share with the landscape industry in North America about what you guys are up to and what to check out, what what would that be? Like what do you want to say to these folks?

Nina Mason (24:14) to take advantage of these opportunities to recognize, you know your sales, your business, and the people within your company. We’ve got an initiative we’re launching next year, which will be an opportunity for people to put their own businesses forward. and receive recognition for their practices. Like I said, we have our rising stars. That’s an opportunity to recognize all the emerging talent. We’ve got an aging workforce and we need to address that. So we need to kind of get these young leaders on board and get them to stay in the industry and to see how they can progress. And also we’ve got a magazine. So talk to us if there’s something that you want to get across to the industry or you think that we need to be talking about.

Rob Murray (24:34) Love that.

Nina Mason (24:53) reach out to us, send us your projects, you can be a magazine cover star. It’s really that easy. So this is an opportunity to not feel that you’re not good enough. I think one of the things that people always think is that they’re not good enough to enter our awards and they’re not good enough to get their projects into the magazine and that’s simply not the case. We want to show the whole breadth of the industry.

Rob Murray (25:14) Love that. So if somebody wants to contact Nina, how do they do that?

Nina Mason (25:17) They can email me at [email protected] or they can call me but it’s a UK mobile number. There are so many ways to get hold of us. We’ve got a big team here. Just reach out.

Rob Murray (25:31) Well and futurescapeusa.com and other resources they can check out. So yeah, we got LA in September, Florida in December.

Nina Mason (25:35) Yeah, well better yet, yeah, come to the show, see us in Paris. Yes, yeah, have the conversations with us, have them with the industry. You know, we’re working with some of the key associations as well. We really, really want to drive change. That’s one of our key objectives is creating a community and driving change. We think we’ve had a really big impact in the landscaping industry in the UK for the last 15 years. And we’re really keen to do the same in the US as well.

Rob Murray (26:01) Love that. what would be a speaker, an author or some air of inspiration that you’ve come across over the last whatever, fifteen years that you think someone should check out?

Nina Mason (26:11) Speaker or author? I mean, we’ve actually in the UK just lost a really, really fantastic landscape architect called Nigel Dunnett. And he introduced this idea of urban greening and it’s absolutely unbelievable. So I think if I would suggest that anyone look somebody up, it would be Nigel Dunnett to understand some of the ways that he’s transformed landscapes in the UK. He was also one of the key people in the Olympic Park. in London for the landscape behind that.

Rob Murray (26:40) Awesome. Urban greening. Nigel, what’s the last name? Dunnett Nina, thank you so much for doing this. Really appreciate you sharing your perspective, your global perspective on the landscape industry.

Nina Mason (26:43) Nigel Dunnett, D-U-N-N-E-T-T. No worries, thanks so much for having me on.